OY! My brain may be a little broke. I’m trying to not to read anyone else reactions before I post mine own, because if I read others’ perspectives I might censor myself. But this season is my last chance to post MY reactions, so here goes:
ELLEN? SHE was never on my dradis. NEVER. I really wanted it to be Adama or Zak. But what really really surprised me was that she was revealed this early... unless Ellen is a fake out? Will Tigh tell the others? And if Ellen is the last Cylon, then what the frak is Starbuck?
My poor darling Kara is all alone again! She needs a hug! But Lee’s all emo over Dee. Adama’s lamenting over everyone else but Kara. Sam’s hung up on a song he sang for a some
The flashbacks and the forensics were intriguing. (On a side note, it was great to see Gaius, the Brilliant Scientist, actually sane. No head!angels, no nymph squad, no evasion. A little bland, but all of a sudden, hot. But if Twitchy Weasel or Lecherous Preacher comes back, I sooooo take that back.) So the final five died two thousand years ago and X-light years away. How did they get reborn on the Colonies? How did they meet then part from the Seven? How do the Seven know of them, when the Five do not know what they are? Why were only five out of all those people resurrected? What happened to the other people on ‘earth’?
‘Earth’ is still in quotations for me. We earthlings have been here for more than 1600 years. (Both the colonists and the 13th tribe left Kobol 4000 years ago (or 3600) ago. They landed in their respective systems and built civilizations. 2000 years ago this planet had humanoid cylons, mechanical-cylons-but-not-colonial, and a nuclear fallout.) Also those skyscraper ruins looked wrong.
Both Humans and Cylons have now lost their faith: Leoben admitted he’s wrong and Laura’s burned Pythia. But because of that or because of the alliance, maybe they both have broken the merry-go-round repetitive cycle. And free from prophecy, as Lee pointed out, they can create a new history. Adama, after a heart-to-heart from Tigh, is gonna latch on to this. But will the Fleet?
I loved the overall theme of dashed hopes and the oppressive guilt by the leaders to gambled their existence based on a mistaken assumption.
But talk about dashed hopes! Little Ana bought it. Hee! (I know, I’m mean.) I admit I was hissing every time she was on screen and was extremely suspicious she’d end up the Fifth. I think RDM wanted to silence all the Dee-bashers by guilt-tripping us with this scene. But sorry, I’m devilishly untroubled! Except for fact that the little martyr-face now has a death-hold on Lee: She’s preventing Kara from sharing her burdens with Lee; and Lee, after being told that he has to be the one to give hope to the Fleet, will feel now guilty for not ‘saving’ her. Well at least, RDM finally gave the actress some decent material and believable motivation before offing her.
BEST PARTS:
• Leoben is afraid. Very afraid. (CKR FTW)
• Tigh’s flashback IN THE WATER. (I love water shots that’s so obviously not filmed in a water tank.)
• Sam + guitar.
• From book-thumping to book-burning. Awwww, poor Laura.
• Kara's burning ?herself?. Twisted!
• Tigh stays stone sober, but only to let BFF Bill lose it.
• Kara wanting to confide with Lee, but being sensitive (finally?) to Lee.
• FRAK EARTH Graffiti.
MEH THINGS:
• The heavy-handedness of the swimming foxes analogy, although it does give Tigh an excuse to swim.
• Lee’s invitation felt contrived just so TPTB would have Lee grieving by Act 4 like a widower rather than an ex. (I mean I thought he grew out of his need for affirmation.)
• The Kara double (just guessing) building the bonfire… nope, it looked liked a guy with a wig.
• No Sam and Kara heart-to-heart. (They better have one soon.)
• D’anna’s staying. And Cavil’s still out there.
Still, all this didn’t detract from a great angsty beginning. I can’t possibly guess what’s next and that’s brilliant! The only thing I fear is that the series finale will be just as depressing. I'm not sure what I'd feel about that.
OTHER RANDOM THINGS:
• What's that plant? Hmmm, Laura seems to have an affinity for hallucinogenic plants.
• Why is Seelix asking for a medic? She has enough medical background (Kobol) to know when it’s useless. And why is she at the CIC bunkroom?
• I really hate that the Hera’s babysitter is Dee. (La la la – I still imagine it's Unca’ Saul) Whose gonna take care of Nicky, now that his dad’s been outted?
• Ruins do not look like 2000 years old.
• Why are the Agathons that happy? Everyone else is miserable. If my hopes and 40,000 of my friends’ hopes were destroyed, I’d really want to BURN the chirpy couple.
• Was that some other Six at Baltar’s Lab? Must’ve been, since both Tigh and Gaius weren’t really reacting to HER. OOO, when or if Ellen comes back, she and Caprica are gonna girlfight over Tigh.
• I miss the green ambrosia.
• Any bets that Lee will never take off that ring now?
• Is there a RDM commentary podcast yet?
Phew, Now I’m free to read what y’all are thinking.
(Please, I’d like remain spoiler-free, but speculation is more than welcome.)
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artemis_90- Artemis
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I will say too I thought the smash cut from devastation to the Agathons playing was the biggest most disjointed smash cut in the ep. I think that was on purpose.
There is a commentary podcast. People have mentioned it.
Er, what's a "smash cut"?
Hmm... I am not sure on the podcast. Oh, there's a commentary with VIDEO link at Hulu here but I'm not sure about podcast after all.
Ugh, Hulu's no good on my overseas computer. But thanks!
And whatever the Lee/Dee stuff was, it was just trying to find a wee little bit of hope in an otherwise unfaceable universe. Lee needed that, and Kara was busy trying to deal with HER own weird reality. I still think it means they're becoming closer though, and I don't believe Lee will feel guilty forever about her death. Kara moved past Zak's, Lee will get past this. He has Kara to hang onto now - SHE will be his anchor and pull him through.
Check out my post ep thoughts too - I get a bit more wordy than this. (surprise, surprise)
I use that term purposely. I have a family member with the same face. I'm disgusted with that type of manipulation although I find myself trapped by it at times. I sometimes do imagine other ways Dee could have been portrayed, but I guess I stopped trying after EoJ and especially after the extended version of UB where she actually articulated her position!
Also, I thought Lee would be beyond his constant need of affirmation - from Dee, from his Dad, from Laura, or even from Kara. Even if he needed a little bit of hope, I didn't see him toning down that goodnight kiss to I'm glad we are still friends kiss. While I agree Kara's being sensitive to Lee, I'm not sure Lee's gonna get pass that guilt sooner than later; and I think Kara's gonna need some backup RFN.
I'm getting through the posts as fast I can, but the discussion and comments out there are fascinating. Lots of people have lots to say!
That they do! And while a lot of it is good fodder for thinking, there is some serious Lee-bashing out there that is making me sick. I HATE that people have double standards - it's okay for Kara to be attention/affirmation seeking from anyone and everyone and okay for her to reach out physically when she's in need, but it's not okay for Lee to have the same feelings and the same responses.
I guess when all is said and done, I'm a libra. All about the fairness. I love both characters to death and both love and hate some of their characteristics. And the only other thing is that no matter how depressed we may be with our lives, none of us has been in a situation likethey are and so their really over the top or unexpected reactions can't be considered out of character.
I didn't see him toning down that goodnight kiss to I'm glad we are still friends kiss.
Personally, I didn't see it as anything but a goodnight kiss. Dee initiated it, Lee pulled away first. Dee was also the one who called it a date - Lee just asked if she wanted a drink and to talk because lord knows, no one else was there for him. His father and Roslin are in their own dark little worlds and Kara's got her own problems (of which he was somewhat cognizant since he referred to the signal when she showed up to talk to him), and Dee was like her old self here, sweet, sympathetic and constant upbeat optimism. I can totally see why Lee would reach out to her. I didn't see any sign that he wanted anything more than to actually have someone to talk to, who would affirm his decisions.
Maybe I'm just a little defensive because there are too many people that wear rose coloured glasses where Kara is concerned and for them, any episode that doesn't feature Kara prominently and have exactly the kind of Lee/Kara interaction they want means it sucks and all they do is pick it apart and say how bad everything is. I really hate that - if all people care about on the show is Lee/Kara, then they're watching the wrong show. That's one subplot - the mythology arc and humanity's survival in general is what the show is all about. Those who are ONLY 'shippers and care about nothing else should stick to watching soaps.
/rant over
Post-Maelstrom, we've seen Lee growing out of his affirmation-seeking. He left his father, he stayed his own course after Dee left, rebelled against Laura, and basically let Kara find her destiny even if it was away from his. But I do think you are right: come to think of it, this particular shock, his back-sliding was, in relative terms, not as bad as Daddy or Mommy's. But you must grant, Kara's bad-assness immolating her own remains pwns all!
if all people care about on the show is Lee/Kara, then they're watching the wrong show O my gods are they ever! I think the true ship here was Adama/Tigh. Actually I expected to see a Kara and Sam scene, so i was greatly surprised that Kara went to search for Lee at Colonial One rather than stay in the surface.
That's one subplot - the mythology arc ... The mythology (you know I love this angle)may sadly be done (purely spec). The end of history or prophecy is what I thought Revelations and SAGN was about. We may get the show mythology of how the earth!five got to the Colonies, which I hope will tie all loose ends.
...and humanity's survival in general is what the show is all about. People's choices and values are different when faced with immense disappointment and far off hope and pure survival. What ideals we think we have now can be suspended while watching this story. Which is why I love this frakking show!
Rants welcome. :) Flames and spoilers NOT.
Edited at 2009-01-19 05:02 pm (UTC)
You've got everything from Adama to Roslin to Dee to everyone else sitting around just drinking and acting like they have nothing to live for so yes, I think Lee's response (given that he's just pretty much been put in charge too, of telling everyone they have nothing left to live for) is definitely not that bad. Reaching out because he needs someone would be perfectly natural in this situation I think.
But you must grant, Kara's bad-assness immolating her own remains pwns all!
OMG yes! I do not dispute that for a second. She truly is the strongest character on the show. Maybe that's what it's all been building to - the people who were the most chipper and had good lives can't handle this news but Kara, who's used to people letting her down and life always kicking her, can find it within herself to keep on going even though she's experiencing everything the others are PLUS so much more.
The mythology (you know I love this angle)may sadly be done (purely spec).
I doubt that. I could go into more detail but I don't think what we've gotten so far (in just one ep) is really the whole truth or depth of the situation. There is much more to come, explanation but also more than just what it seems.
People's choices and values are different when faced with immense disappointment and far off hope and pure survival. What ideals we think we have now can be suspended while watching this story. Which is why I love this frakking show!
Exactly! I think it's a really interesting commentary too to see what happens when you put so many people together in close quarters, who all have very differing values about life. Make them live together for years always touching shoulders and you see what explodes. :)
There are characters on this show that I would hate if they were real life, including Kara. She constantly pisses me off and disappoints me with her bad choices but I do enjoy watching it and seeing how the character is growing as time goes by. THAT'S what makes it interesting I think.
No worries - no flames and no spoilers here. Rants I'm pretty good at. (But you knew that already.) :)
I'm actually surprised that there's only one suicide (Lee's just erasing the ones digit). I really love Kara's character and her messed up choices. Its only in story form we can explore the what if? In real life, I'd be more like Lee I guess... not the eloquence and the public speaking, but the prioritizing ideals above the pragmatic and really hard choices espoused by Roslin. I really like how it bit him in the ass in S1 and S2; I'm not sure how he's gonna balance power and his ideals in a realistic way (only in TV can you have both all the time).
I really like how it bit him in the ass in S1 and S2; I'm not sure how he's gonna balance power and his ideals in a realistic way (only in TV can you have both all the time).
Too true. The nice thing about BSG is that you get to live vicariously through the characters and imagine what you yourself would do in that situation without actually having to do it. Or in my case, imagine what it would be like to be someone like say, Kara, whom I'm nothing like and in fact have issue with in a lot of ways. But she is kickass and cool and sexy and imagining I am too is kind of fun. :)
When you think about it that way, it becomes less of a 'O, the Agathons have Hera to love; they don't care about finding earth' situation and more of a place where you see two people who are devestated, but have to put on happy faces for their daughter, so they go completely overboard.
Also, after rewatching the episode, I'm not sure it's Seelix who's calling for the Medic. It sort of sounds like a male voice, and while it's clearly not Gaeta, it might be that guy in the yellow deckhand overalls who rushes into the room and is barely onscreen in that scene. That would make a little more sense than Seelix thinking a medic could do anything for a gunshot to the head.
I'm going to have to rewatch that pyre-building scene to see if you're right about it not being Katee (or a woman, period). I was too caught up in the emotion of it the first time I watched it, and too busy admiring how amazingly consistent the light was throughout the scene when I rewatched it. Because seriously, shooting anything at dusk or dawn like that without loosing the light is very hard.
Anyways, the timeline thing, possible continuity errors, the question of if the 13th tribe left Kobal before the other 12 or at the same time, and a handful of possible explanations involving time dilation are discussed here. The post by someone called Werthead is the most sense-making thing I've read so far.
http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.c
Thanks for the links, except... are there any spoilers?
OMG, that is exactly what happened! I'm so impressed with this thought that I'm referencing it in my next post.
Enjoyed your review!
thanks for reading! I'm actually right now reading the comments on your post!
It kind of did for me. I'm yet to feel happy about Dee's death. I'm not sure I ever will.
I've actually had a rehash on my reaction to the ep which I just posted so don't take all my initial reactions as my final word.
except, wait - Hera didn't seem particularly upset; I mean in Revelations, she seemed to be the only one who's hopes weren't raised. Or maybe the Agathons needed to mollify themselves this way...
-Mom1 got shot dead and she was lieing on the cold cold ground till someone came along and took her.
-Then there were lots of Mom 2&3&4 (aka 8, 3, and 6)
-But they were weird and distant. And she had a bad tummy ache.
-Then another Mom2 came along and argued with another Mom2 and a Mom4 and one of the Mom2s tried to hurt her (and boy did she have a bad tummy ache)
-The Mom4 killed one of the Mom2s and they ran away.
-Then Mom4 vanished again and the new Mom2 was around a lot.
-Then she saw Mom4 looking like Mom3!
-Yeah!
-Then Mom2 shot Mom4.
:....(
kid needs lots o' therapy.
LOLz